Podcast Archives

[VIDEO] How to Escape the Pursue-Withdraw Trap in Your Relationship

You’re in a relationship where every argument feels like you’re on a treadmill to nowhere. One of you chases for connection, while the other retreats into silence. This is the pursue-withdraw pattern, and it’s not just frustrating; it’s emotionally exhausting.

What is the Pursue-Withdraw Pattern?

The pursue-withdraw pattern is a common dynamic in relationships where one partner (the pursuer) seeks more interaction, validation, or resolution during conflicts, while the other (the withdrawer) feels overwhelmed and tends to retreat or disengage.

John Allan Whitacre, AMFT, describes this vividly: “One person is going to stop at a rock and basically sit there and say, ‘Let’s just stop entirely. Let’s act like it didn’t happen.'” Here, the withdrawer might feel they’re not good enough or fear being criticized, leading to a retreat from interaction.

On the other hand, the pursuer, feeling neglected or anxious, might push for engagement, as Whitacre explains, “Another person may have been waiting all day at work to basically attend to their internal to-do list,” indicating a desire for resolution or closeness.

Pursue-Withdraw Pattern Causes Couples to Fight

The Emotional Toll: When one partner withdraws, seeking solitude or disengagement from the conflict, the other often feels abandoned or unloved, leading to a cycle of blame and retreat that can deepen the rift between you. This pattern becomes a repetitive dance where neither feels truly heard or understood.

Heightened Anxiety: This pattern isn’t just about disagreement; it’s about survival mode in your relationship. “We need to be able to fall back when life gets hard,” says Dr. Connor McClenahan, highlighting how this dynamic can turn a partner into a source of stress rather than support, escalating anxiety for both. The pursuer might feel desperate for reassurance, while the withdrawer feels overwhelmed by the demand for closeness, creating a vicious cycle of increasing tension.

Connection and Identity is at Stake

Loss of Connection: Every cycle of pursue and withdraw chips away at the trust and intimacy you’ve built. “They’re both longing for safety,” Whitacre notes, but instead of finding it in each other, partners can feel increasingly isolated, even when they’re together. This lack of connection can lead to a profound sense of loneliness within the relationship.

Identity and Self-Worth: “I’m not good enough, so I need to retreat,” Whitacre describes the internal narrative of the withdrawer. Meanwhile, the pursuer might feel, “I need you. Where are you?” This dynamic can leave both questioning their value in the relationship and to each other. Over time, this can erode self-esteem and the belief in the relationship’s potential for happiness and fulfillment.

Awareness Breaks the Pursue-Withdraw Pattern

Awareness is Key: “Especially on the front end. A lot of my work with couples is just helping them notice when they are coping,” Whitacre shares. Recognizing these roles you play can be the first step to breaking free from them. It’s about seeing the pattern for what it is—a defense mechanism rather than a personal attack or disinterest.

Communication Over Reaction: Instead of reacting out of hurt or fear, Whitacre pushes for understanding underlying needs. “What are you really trying to say to them?” he asks, encouraging couples to speak to their true feelings rather than their immediate frustrations. This shift can transform heated arguments into moments of vulnerability and connection.

The Healing Power of Therapy: “There actually is an opportunity to choose to either react to your feelings or respond to them,” Whitacre suggests. Couples therapy can provide a safe space to explore these dynamics, learn new communication skills, and rebuild the connection. It’s about slowing down the interaction, allowing each partner to express what’s beneath the surface—fears, desires, and hopes.

A New Beginning as a Couple

The pursue-withdraw pattern doesn’t have to define your relationship. By confronting this cycle head-on, you can transform your partnership from one of survival and stress to one of mutual support and understanding. This podcast episode isn’t just about identifying a problem; it’s about offering a lifeline to couples caught in this loop, giving them the tools to reconnect, re-engage, and rediscover each other in healthier, more loving ways.

Imagine replacing those moments of withdrawal with gentle requests for space or understanding, and those moments of pursuit with compassionate invitations for closeness. By learning to communicate your needs without the baggage of past patterns, you can begin to build a relationship based on mutual respect, empathy, and love. If you’re ready to step off that treadmill, it’s time to start rewriting your relationship story, one conversation at a time.

Couples therapy with John Allan Whitacre, AMFT

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Managing emotions, Podcast

[Video] Take off your “depression lens” by experiencing awe

Written by McKenzie Laird

So you’ve just encountered a disappointing setback at work that’s puts into question your self-worth. With every passing day, you feel negativity taking over. Its subtle at first, but is now overriding your system, leaving you wanting to do as little as possible. Feelings of hopelessness sweep over you, and it’s hard to get out of bed. Pretty soon you’re convinced nothing can make the situation better. Not wanting friends and family to experience you like this, you begin to isolate yourself and cancel existing plans. You wish there were something to pluck you from this debilitating spiral, but it just feels too powerful.

You wonder, “why is this happening to me?” You’re frustrated with yourself yet powerless to shift your mind or your body away from this pattern.

Awe: the counterweight to depression

Depression is connected to the complex emotional experience we call awe. Awe is the experience of making meaning from vastness and seeing the world differently as a result.

For instance, imagine this scenario:

You’re not much of a camper, but your friends pull you to join them on their annual camping trip to Yosemite. The impact of the night sky in nature is something you’re aware of intellectually. You’ve even been before, once or twice. However, there’s something about being here this time confronting you with just how incredibly small you are, and you hold your hands up to the sky for scale.

As you lie outside gazing into the dark and star-filled void, your mind wanders away from your small size and into the idea of being human. You look to the left and right of you at your friends. They each have their faces turned toward the sky. It’s quiet. You’re suddenly aware that you’re all together. Together at this campsite, in this country, on this planet. The silence breaks from bristling leaves. Then a crack of laughter. Someone leans over to you and asks, “so, why do you think we’re here?”

Awe Moves Us From The Physical to The Psychological to The Existential.

Religious experiences, the birth of a child, and sunrises are some of the many experiences people claim as awe-inducing in their lives. Experiences of awe move the body from the sympathetic into the parasympathetic system of functioning. This is movement from our threat detection system to our relaxation and connective systems. For instance, the awe of watching a sunrise provides our body the sense of safety needed to access self-reflection and awareness.

This way, awe-based experiences are encounters with uncertainty. Encounters with wonder in physical, social, or conceptual forms confront us with our physical smallness and cognitive limitations. The fascinating details of a clear night sky, powerful waterfall, or stadium cheering decreases our self-focus and heightens our attention of the outside world. As we focus less on ourselves, interactions with vastness can challenge our ideas of the world. As a result, awe inspires acceptance of the world in all its uncertainty and mystery.

Awe Changes Depression by Breaking Up Negative Thoughts .

Aspects of depression such as rumination and hopelessness emerge from strongly held beliefs about what the world is like. These beliefs about the world and ourselves then prime how we predict and react to the events around us. Outdated beliefs about life, such as “the world is entirely unsafe” keep us stuck in these depressive symptoms. However, feeling awe can help loosen the grip that our outdated beliefs about life have on us. This is because awe-filled encounters decrease our self-focus, which gets heightened in depression. Rigid and unhelpful beliefs loosen through encounters with vastness. This offers our brain a chance to update how we predict and react to people and situations in our lives.

In one frame work called the Matryoshka Model, you can trace how encounters with awe shift from our electrical impulses to our physiology, to our psychology, and eventually to our attitudes about life.

Let’s delve into how the Matryoshka Model can illustrate the transformative power of awe on depression through different layers, like those nesting dolls, but with each layer representing a different type of change.

1. Awe Creates Neurological Changes in Depression

Firstly, let’s talk about electrical changes. When you’re in awe, it’s like your brain gets a reboot. Think of it as the lights coming back on in a room that’s been dark too long. Depression often dims our neural activity, but awe can spark a surge of electrical activity in areas like the prefrontal cortex, which is involved in attention and emotional regulation. This can disrupt the repetitive, negative thought patterns that characterize depression, giving you a new, brighter perspective.

2. Awe Creates Immediate Changes in Depression

Next, we move to immediate psychological changes. Awe acts like a lens, expanding your view from the narrow focus of self to the vastness around you. It’s like stepping out of a tiny, cramped room into an open field. This shift can halt the rumination cycle, where you’re stuck replaying your worries. Instead, you’re now engaged with something larger and more magnificent, which can lift your mood and bring a sense of peace, even if just for a moment.

3. Awe Creates Cortisol Changes in Depression

Diving deeper, there are neuroendocrinal psychological changes. Here, awe starts playing with the chemistry of your mind. It’s known to reduce levels of stress hormones like cortisol while possibly boosting feel-good neurotransmitters like serotonin. This biochemical shift can help ease the physical symptoms of depression, like fatigue or pain, by calming the body’s stress response. It’s like awe sends a message to your body: “Let’s dial down the stress, shall we?”

4. Awe Creates Existential Changes in Depression

At the core, we have existential changes. Awe might not just change how you feel momentarily; it can alter how you see your place in the universe. Depression can make you feel insignificant or lost, but awe can reconnect you with a sense of purpose or meaning. It’s like opening the last doll to find not just another doll but a whole new world of possibilities. This layer can inspire you to rethink your life’s narrative, encouraging a journey towards what truly matters to you, fostering hope and resilience against depression.

So, through the Matryoshka Model, awe isn’t just a fleeting emotion; it’s a layered experience that can touch every part of your being—from the electrical zaps in your neurons to the deepest sense of your existence. Each layer peels back another aspect of depression, making way for healing and growth.

Awe Can Sometimes Increase Depression

While awe can induce feelings of greater connectedness to the world around us, the reality is that encounters with awe-inspiring events can also inspire feelings of powerlessness and insignificance. This occurs when the event is a frightening or saddening one, such as a destructive wildfire, severe snowstorm, or heart wrenching documentary about an issue you care about. When we begin to experience isolation, loneliness, and insignificance as a result of scary and tragic encounters, this is a signal that it’s time to reach out for connection from safe and trusted others. Finding connection with other people after difficult encounters helps us to channel our feelings of awe into a greater source of wisdom and meaning in life. Despite the complexities of awe, seeking out positive experiences of awe can promote our well being and thriving.

Seek Awe in the Everyday

Awe is both a collective and deeply personal experience. While it’s found by immersing oneself in nature, it’s also discovered in the details of daily life. According to Ambre Associates, Awe can be found without major travel or expenses with these 5 minute practices. Some include:

Taking a slow walk, stopping to gaze at something that catches your attention.

Listening differently. Focus on the sounds of the instruments in your favorite song, tune into the sounds of nature and public life.

Listening to a speech delivered by your favorite speaker.

Following Instagram accounts that share pictures of nature.

Reach out for help

Connect with someone who can support you in understanding existential depression and it’s impact on yourself, work, friends, and family. I help people access inner strength so they can lead lives of greater safety and freedom.

Therapy for trauma and depression with McKenzie Laird, AMFT

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Anxiety, Podcast, Somatic Exercises

[VIDEO] Somatic Therapist on How to Harness the Miraculous Power of Memory and Motion

Written by herecounseling

Arianne MacBean, a somatic therapist with a profound background in dance education and choreography, helps people with trauma and anxiety to create change using their bodies. On the surface, this idea sounds trivial, yet as Arianne explains, the body is absolutely central in any process of healing. Arianne shared her unique journey from leading dance workshops for veterans to becoming a somatic psychotherapist, illustrating how movement and memory can catalyze deep emotional and psychological healing.

How veterans heal trauma through movement

Arianne’s work began with veterans through “The Collective Memory Project,” where she combined writing and movement to help veterans process their memories. “We were dealing with memory making as a relational process,” Arianne explains. “It changes as you tell it and share it.” This initiative was not just about dance but about using movement as a medium to externalize and reinterpret personal experiences. Veterans found themselves in a space where their memories could be shared, reshaped, and witnessed by others, leading to profound moments of vulnerability, healing, and sometimes, performance on stage alongside professional dancers.

Moving from dance to therapy

The transition from dance educator to therapist was driven by Arianne’s realization of the deep therapeutic impact her workshops had. She noticed that moving memories physically allowed for an emotional release that talking alone could not achieve. “What we were doing was incredibly evocative, provocative, emotional, vulnerable, and healing,” Arianne recounts. This insight led her to pursue further skills in somatic psychotherapy, where she could formally integrate these practices into healing processes.

How Somatic Therapy Works

Arianne describes how, in therapy sessions, she encourages clients to embody their emotions or memories physically. “It’s a kind of embodied way of processing experience,” she notes. For example, she recounts a session where a client with an autoimmune condition physically took on a posture from a painful memory, leading to significant emotional shifts. This method isn’t about escaping discomfort but about engaging with it in a controlled, therapeutic setting, which can lead to acceptance and eventual relief.

The process allows for a re-experiencing of trauma in a safe environment, where the body’s memory can be explored and reframed. “It’s about feeling change, not just thinking it,” Arianne adds, emphasizing the emotional and bodily release that somatic therapy facilitates.

Somatic therapy exercises actually involve two people: you and the therapist

One of the key takeaways from Arianne’s discussion is the human connection in therapy. By sharing and mirroring physical expressions, both therapist and client connect on a primal, empathetic level. “I do a lot of movement with them too; I mirror what they’re doing,” Arianne shares, highlighting how this practice fosters an environment where healing can occur not just through distance or professional detachment but through shared human experience.

3 Somatic Therapy Exercises

Arianne suggests simple exercises for those dealing with panic or pain:

Acknowledge the Sensation: Recognize the pain or panic as a signal, not an enemy. “Hello, anxiety,” she suggests as a way to acknowledge rather than fight the feeling.
Breathe Into It: Instead of breathing away from the discomfort, breathe into it, sending your breath to where you feel the pain or anxiety. “It’s about inhaling and exhaling into the sensation,” she explains.
Re-center in the Present: Remind yourself of your current safety and environment, grounding yourself back to the present moment. “You’re here, you’re okay,” she reassures.

Arianne MacBean’s journey from the stage to the therapy room highlights a beautiful synergy between art and healing. Her work underscores the potential of somatic practices in psychological therapy, offering hope and new methods for those seeking to heal from deep-seated traumas or chronic conditions through the power of their own bodies. Her approach not only transforms personal narratives but also invites everyone to rethink how we engage with our emotions and memories, fostering a space where healing is both an individual and communal journey.

Learn about Somatic Therapy for Trauma

Podcast